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Proiect satelit coaxial 12 inch+2 inch hornloaded-FX12
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Autor:  Foca_Dacian [ Dum Noi 21, 2010 7:07 pm ]
Subiectul mesajului:  Proiect satelit coaxial 12 inch+2 inch hornloaded-FX12

Material folosit 18mm+12mm

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Autor:  prv_florin [ Vin Apr 19, 2013 9:51 am ]
Subiectul mesajului:  Re: Proiect satelit coaxial 12 inch+2 inch hornloaded-FX12

Buna, as vrea sa stiu ce difuzor ar merge in aceasta incinta altul decat care e in schita.

Autor:  Mircea Bartic [ Vin Apr 19, 2013 9:54 am ]
Subiectul mesajului:  Re: Proiect satelit coaxial 12 inch+2 inch hornloaded-FX12

JBL Selenium 12MB3P

o sa revina in stoc in vre 2 saptamani.

Acela este cel mai performant

Autor:  Lupascu Marian [ Dum Aug 04, 2013 12:11 am ]
Subiectul mesajului:  Re: Proiect satelit coaxial 12 inch+2 inch hornloaded-FX12

Am facut 2 subwoofere planar horn si in curand voi mai face 2, iar dupa vreau sa fac satelitii. Ce model imi recomandati? Sa fac 2 sau 4 sateliti dupa modelul fx12 sau 2 sateliti 2x12" coaxial horn?

Autor:  Mircea Bartic [ Mie Aug 07, 2013 11:52 am ]
Subiectul mesajului:  Re: Proiect satelit coaxial 12 inch+2 inch hornloaded-FX12

depinde de ce fel de sonorizari faci in mod uzual

Autor:  Lupascu Marian [ Mie Aug 07, 2013 6:08 pm ]
Subiectul mesajului:  Re: Proiect satelit coaxial 12 inch+2 inch hornloaded-FX12

Ms Mircea pentru raspuns...dar am vorbit intre timp la telefon si mi.ai recomandat sa fac fx12 pentru aplicatiile live. Te rog sa.mi mai spui o data ce horn si driver ai spus sa folosesc si daca se poate sa.mi spui si preturile lor sau sa-mi dai un email cu ele (appolo.studio@yahoo.com).

Legat de acest proiect..am si eu 2 intrebari:
Ce material sa folosesc la incinte? Subwooferele le-am facut din mdf si e destul de greu de lucrat cu el pentru ca se crapa destul de repede...cu toate ca pana la urma am gasit ce holtsuruburi sa folosesc. Daca a lucrat cineva cu tego(nu stiu sigur daca asa se numeste acel placaj stratificat), as vrea sa-mi spuna daca e mai ok cu acel material si daca se gaseste asa ceva cu fetele simple(fara stratul maro care nu stiu ce este dar am vazut ca multi il smirgheluiesc inainte de a vopsi boxele).
Daca spatiul gol care ramane intre laturile exterioare si cele de la hornul de medii le umplu cu spuma poliuretanica e vreo problema? Sau nu este vibratia asa de mare ca la basi incat sa fie nevoie de asa ceva sau ramforsari prea multe.
Va multumesc si orice ajutor este binevenit

Autor:  Mircea Bartic [ Vin Aug 09, 2013 10:14 am ]
Subiectul mesajului:  Re: Proiect satelit coaxial 12 inch+2 inch hornloaded-FX12

Lupascu Marian scrie:
Ms Mircea pentru raspuns...dar am vorbit intre timp la telefon si mi.ai recomandat sa fac fx12 pentru aplicatiile live. Te rog sa.mi mai spui o data ce horn si driver ai spus sa folosesc si daca se poate sa.mi spui si preturile lor sau sa-mi dai un email cu ele (appolo.studio@yahoo.com).

Legat de acest proiect..am si eu 2 intrebari:
Ce material sa folosesc la incinte? Subwooferele le-am facut din mdf si e destul de greu de lucrat cu el pentru ca se crapa destul de repede...cu toate ca pana la urma am gasit ce holtsuruburi sa folosesc. Daca a lucrat cineva cu tego(nu stiu sigur daca asa se numeste acel placaj stratificat), as vrea sa-mi spuna daca e mai ok cu acel material si daca se gaseste asa ceva cu fetele simple(fara stratul maro care nu stiu ce este dar am vazut ca multi il smirgheluiesc inainte de a vopsi boxele).
Daca spatiul gol care ramane intre laturile exterioare si cele de la hornul de medii le umplu cu spuma poliuretanica e vreo problema? Sau nu este vibratia asa de mare ca la basi incat sa fie nevoie de asa ceva sau ramforsari prea multe.
Va multumesc si orice ajutor este binevenit


Recomand Plywood.
Tego este plywood cu film fenolic si se foloseste in constructii la asamblarea cofrajelor.
Se pot face boxe din el, insa va trebui indepartat filmul acela de la suprafata pentru a putea face priza adezivii.
In MDF exista cateva reguli:

Se pregaureste cu burghiu de 2.5-3mm in functe de suruburile folosite si nu se dau niciodata gauri in cant mai aproape de 70mm de capatul colii.

Poti sa umplii spatiul gol din incinta cu spuma poliuretanica, chiar este indicat.

Difuzoare recomandate:

JBL Selenium 12MB3P sau P-audio SN-12MBII - ambele se afla in stoc
P-audio BM-D740II - pe stoc
P-audio PH 3022 - pe stoc

Autor:  Cretu Adi [ Mar Iul 14, 2015 8:50 am ]
Subiectul mesajului:  Re: Proiect satelit coaxial 12 inch+2 inch hornloaded-FX12

Un cutlist va fi de mare ajutor daca se poate. Multumesc

Autor:  Pavel_Vlad [ Mar Aug 13, 2019 6:27 pm ]
Subiectul mesajului:  Re: Proiect satelit coaxial 12 inch+2 inch hornloaded-FX12

Hi, folks.

There are a phase-inverting port can be added in mid-cabinet design.
160 sq cm area and 8 cm depth outside of mouth.

It will ventilate rear chamber and allow more power headroom.

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Poweraudio_midhorn.PNG
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Autor:  Mircea Bartic [ Mar Aug 13, 2019 8:56 pm ]
Subiectul mesajului:  Re: Proiect satelit coaxial 12 inch+2 inch hornloaded-FX12

Can you also post a displacement graph at 500W?

Autor:  Pavel_Vlad [ Mie Aug 14, 2019 5:27 pm ]
Subiectul mesajului:  Re: Proiect satelit coaxial 12 inch+2 inch hornloaded-FX12

Mircea Bartic scrie:
Can you also post a displacement graph at 500W?


Hi, Mircea!

Of course, let’s choose the driver itself.
Recommended?
Well-known performer 12MB650?
Or something extreme like MB12N405?
And let me know about possibility to optimize rear chamber volume based on driver performance. This will not interfere with design outline, only inner braces placement.

Autor:  Mircea Bartic [ Joi Aug 15, 2019 9:23 am ]
Subiectul mesajului:  Re: Proiect satelit coaxial 12 inch+2 inch hornloaded-FX12

choose any driver you like

the reason is that I want to compare the displacement graph between the 2 situations (with and without port)

also, the port will add extension but that won't really make such a big difference. The horn mouth will become directive after a retain frequency. Pattern control will be absent in the frequency band that the port acts so it's better to have that extension provided by dedicated speakers than to force the midbass from the midhorn that low.

for small events it is a solution but as the number of speakers increases the port won't make such a big difference.
Also group delay will suffer and you will have phase issues which will make the sound muddy. This is one of the main reasons I'm not a big fan of porting horns

Autor:  Pavel_Vlad [ Joi Aug 15, 2019 10:39 am ]
Subiectul mesajului:  Re: Proiect satelit coaxial 12 inch+2 inch hornloaded-FX12

Mircea Bartic scrie:
the reason is that I want to compare the displacement graph between the 2 situations (with and without port)


Ok, 12MB650. 600Wt/8Ohm
I've placed optimistical 60 Hz LR24 filter and then tune port freq to that of the maximum displacement.

Mircea Bartic scrie:
also, the port will add extension but that won't really make such a big difference. The horn mouth will become directive after a retain frequency. Pattern control will be absent in the frequency band that the port acts so it's better to have that extension provided by dedicated speakers than to force the midbass from the midhorn that low.


Pattern control of that size mouth becomes directive not less than 350 Hz, so adding extra lower end response are needed mostly to obtain "fast punchy" kick from the midbass driver with lower Mms/Bl ratio than subwoofer.

Mircea Bartic scrie:
for small events it is a solution but as the number of speakers increases the port won't make such a big difference.
Also group delay will suffer and you will have phase issues which will make the sound muddy. This is one of the main reasons I'm not a big fan of porting horns


Yes. There will be choose for builder:
1. Precise response, but lower power headroom and less mid-bass response. I'ld prefer that for smaller venues
2. A little harder for align ported enclosure, but more power headroom and punchy "kick".

Fişiere ataşate:
12MB650_displ.PNG
12MB650_displ.PNG [ 19.54 KiB | Vizualizat de 20374 ori ]

Autor:  Mircea Bartic [ Joi Aug 15, 2019 11:25 am ]
Subiectul mesajului:  Re: Proiect satelit coaxial 12 inch+2 inch hornloaded-FX12

every speaker has some compromises in the end. so it's either limited low end response with better clarity
or a better low end extension with some loss of clarity.

It really depends on the style of music played trough the system

for high quality live vocal applications no port would be better

For electronic music , disco, etc port would be usefull

Autor:  Pavel_Vlad [ Mie Aug 21, 2019 7:01 am ]
Subiectul mesajului:  Re: Proiect satelit coaxial 12 inch+2 inch hornloaded-FX12

Mircea Bartic scrie:
every speaker has some compromises in the end. so it's either limited low end response with better clarity
or a better low end extension with some loss of clarity.


Or a huge DSP...
:wink:

One active/DSP-based all-pass filter mostly eliminates port phase inversion and restores phase and group delay to a closed box one.
Of course with the same mechanical damping provided, so Qts must be +- equal.
There are no way since one comes to dedicated speaker enclosures or line array.

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